A treatise on shipbuilding: and a treatise on rigging, written about 1620-1625.

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  • #9252
    Wayne Tripp
    Participant

    I am trying to locate a source for the Society for Nautical research Occasional Publication Number 6
    Salisbury, W., & Anderson, R. C. (1958). A treatise on shipbuilding: And a treatise on rigging, written about 1620-1625. London: Society for Nautical Research.

    If anyone happens to come across a copy that is available for purchase I would be most grateful. I have already tried the usual suspects without success.

    Many thanks!

    #9429
    Wendy v
    Participant

    Hi there, Send me an email to wendy.vanduivenvoorde@flinders.edu.au and I will send you a pdf of the manuscript. Best, Wendy

    #9432
    Sam Willis
    Moderator

    Hi Wayne/Wendy.

    I find the early date of this treatise rather surprising. I am familiar with much of the material in the 18thC. Was there much other material published in the first half of the 17thC? How early does it go?

    Sam Willis

    #9433
    J.D. Davies
    Participant

    According to Richard Endsor, author of The Restoration Warship, a manuscript copy of this treatise is at the National Archives, Kew, in ADM 7/827.

    #9434
    Wayne Tripp
    Participant

    Sam –

    While there is not a large body of published material concerning shipbuilding from the early 17th century, there is some. For example, Richard Barker published A Manuscript on Shipbuilding, Circa 1600, Copied by Newton in the Mariner’s Mirror, 80(1), 16–29 (1994). In addition, there is also Fragments of Ancient English Shipwrighty from the Pepysian Library, apparently written by two men (Mathew Baker and then it is believed to have been added to by John Wells of Deptford Dockyard) in the period 1570 – 1630, and bound in its present form by Pepys some 30 or more years later.

    #9436
    F.L. F
    Participant

    From F.L. F

    Sam, Wayne, Wendy, and J.D. D

    I have had many occasions to use the Treatise on Shipbuilding over the years. It is a wonderful source for early 17th-century terminology and custom — orlop for gundeck, deck for the later upper deck, false beams where the later orlop would be, the cook room on the false beams, the positions of staircases, gratings between the guns not present later, etc. And the draughting data, plus surprises such as the camber being greatest at the gundeck (orlop in those days) and reduced above. Much valuable information for archaeologists and shipbuilding historians alike.

    #9792
    Susan M
    Participant

    You may be interested in earlier mention of catharpings (Notes, John Harland, “Catharpings, Swifters and Banetinck Shrouds” MM 95:3, 328-336)
    Thomas Hariot (BL Ms 6788) whilst consulting/ talking with Mathew Baker wrote a series of notes on ropes (8 folios). This has been recently dated to 1608 by Jacqueline Steddall. On folio 1 at no.11 he wrote “Catharpins. to keepe the shroudes tought [taut]” accompanied by a sketch showing the “shroudes” and “deadmaneye.” He goes on to describe collars of the stays and standing tackles on the same folio. The following folio describes other ropes, with a sketch of a furled sail and his notes work systematically through the types of ropes and their uses. The Manuscript continues with 6 folios on the ship’s parts and then returns to ropes referenced to sails followed by 2 folios listing gterms used. The last folio he refers to Baker’s rule of the proportion of breadth to length but does not go into detail.

    Could anyone help with the meaning of “shiner” which is mentioned several times in the following folios? I only have access to “The sailor’s Wordbook” where there is no mention as far as I know, and I cannot work out its meaning from the context as my technical knowledge is very limited.
    Sue Maxwell member

    #9807
    Wayne Tripp
    Participant

    I have checked in Smiths Seaman’s Grammar (1691) and find several mentions of SHIVERS, which are known in more modern terms as SHEAVES – the rotating pulley within a block.

    Could you provide an example of how SHINERS is used?

    #9875
    Wayne Tripp
    Participant

    For those interested, there is a wonderful collection of the manuscripts of Thomas Harriot available at http://echo.mpiwg-berlin.mpg.de/content/scientific_revolution/harriot

    The Project “The manuscripts of Thomas Harriot (1560–1621)”aims not only to publish Harriot’s surviving papers but to organize them in such a way that readers can find their way more easily through the disordered raw material. We have therefore classified the papers into several main topics: navigation, mechanics, optics, algebra, geometry, astronomy, and so on. Within each topic, there are further subdivisions, down to small related groups of manuscript pages. This structure can be navigated through sequences of clickable maps.

    #9877
    Sam Willis
    Moderator

    Thanks for that Wayne. As you mention Harriot, this may be of interest: It is an interesting article on Harriot and the Roanoke Voyage and in particular on Harriot’s ‘Briefe and True Report of the New Found Land of Virginia’ (1588). It argues that the production of knowledge was closely tied to the production of capital. And to bring this back round to the original Topic – published and accessible treatises on rigging and shipbuilding were all very much a part of that growth in knowledge.

    #10206
    Robert Legge
    Participant

    This publication was reprinted in the appendix of
    The Galleon – The Great Ships of the Armada Era by Peter
    kirsch; Conway Maritime Press, Ltd; 1990; ISBN 0 85177 566 2
    Bob Legge

    #10577
    Anonymous
    Inactive

    Hi Wendy, I am also very interrested in this manuscript. Can you send it to me too ? (MasterShipwright@aol.com)

    Would be very happy, thank you !

    Tom

    #10576
    Anonymous
    Inactive

    Hi Wendy, I am also interrested in the manuscript. Can you send me this PDF you have ?
    Thanks, Tom

    #12855
    Richard K
    Participant

    Hello Wendy, It looks like a little over a year since your post offering the pdf, and while I am a little late in this dialog (joined only recently) is it possible to send me a pdf copy also?

    Many thanks, Richard

    “A treatise on shipbuilding: And a treatise on rigging, written about 1620-1625, London: Society for Nautical Research.”

    #17762
    Anonymous
    Inactive

    I’m VERY late to this discussion. I, too, would like to obtain a copy of the treatise on shipbuilding. Is it still available? If not, can you suggest where I might find a copy?

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